This is what happens when you piss off Men’s Rights Activists

hate group

I first became aware of the group A Voice for Men (AVfM) because of an article by its founder, Paul Elam, entitled “Study Reveals Female Rape Victims Enjoyed the Experience.” After reading other remarkable works such as “When Is It Okay to Punch Your Wife?” and “I’ll decide If You Were Raped, Not You,” I decided to take a closer look at this legendary apologist of the men’s rights movement (MRM).

The MRM is best known for vitriolic attacks on feminists and the issues they hold dear.  The manosphere is the haven where men’s rights activists (MRAs) gather, because it is a safe place to confide their suffering anonymously, discuss strategy, and express disdain for women’s empowerment. The leaders of this movement, like Paul Elam and Tom Ball, have caused barely a ripple in the media despite the ostentatious attention-getting antics of the former and the public self-immolation and suicide note of the latter. On top of near-pariah status in media, the movement, as well as Elam personally, have been criticized by the Southern Poverty Law Center because of their frightening threats, cyber-bullying, and expressions of hate.

After my engagement with the users of AVfM, it wasn’t long before I was hatefully slandered, as well!

Engaging MRAs as a Male Feminist

I made three posts on the forums of AVfM asking general questions about the MRM and specifically about the group’s radical anti-feminism, generating around 200 replies and a dozen private messages. I confided that I was molested by a preacher at 18 and that I had once been sexually exploited while unconscious. I also identified myself as a feminist and explained how my wife’s experience of gangrape as a teenager had cemented my convictions against sexual violence and the failures of the justice system.

There was plenty of incendiary comments from both sides, as is the rule on the internet in general and among men’s rights activists (MRAs) in particular. Many bristled at the insensitivity of my comments, but after some interaction we both managed to mellow out enough to have a constructive discussion. I exchanged private messages with a man who was raped and later stalked for two years by a woman as well as a guy who sought my advice because he was in a relationship with a rape victim. I also interacted with a woman who had worked as a counselor to rape victims that had cautiously infiltrated the group to offer support to the more receptive among them. These were the exceptions, however, most of them included long lines of slurs directed at me and referred to youtube videos and blogs to corroborate their arguments, while fastidiously reminding me to rely on “peer-reviewed” journals for my research.

When I asked why MRAs excoriate anyone who promotes women’s rights, they suggested that gender equality was achieved in the past and that it is, actually, men who are being victimized on a far greater scale, because of homelessness, unemployment, and suicide, because of custody battles where mothers are disproportionately awarded care of the children, and because of men falsely accused of rape or raped by women but never acknowledged as victims. Fair enough.

The links above confirm that there is something to these claims, although I have a problem with the false accusation issue that I will address below.

I began to feel sorry for the users on AVfM, in spite of their their misguided hatred of feminism and the dearth of research supporting their claims. I realized that I had discounted how sexual assault affects men and began to analyze the trajectory of my own life after the adverse experiences I buried in the past.

However, my sympathy stopped cold at the point where MRAs promoted the idea that feminism is a groundless hoax and that patriarchy doesn’t exist, an epiphany users on AVfM refer to as “taking the red pill,” which opens the eyes of the initiate to our anti-male society where feminists engineer the laws and structure government funding to serve women’s interests, at the expense of men.


Despite the fact that taking away fathers’ rights in custody battles has never been a goal of feminism and that leading feminists recognize and support rape victims regardless of gender, the MRM refuses accept that patriarchy, not feminism, is the original cause of their suffering with the age-old litanies that “fathers are breadwinners; mothers raise children” and “men must have a stiff upper lip and cannot be victims.”

Furthermore, the MRM is overwhelmingly right-wing, while it is plain to see that most of the people on AVfM are in desperate need of the counseling services and therapy that are in the crosshairs of the Tea-Party budget hawks they support. Thus duped by their true ideological foes, the mocking, sadistic attacks of MRAs on feminists only weaken their credibility in the public discourse and make them seem gullible, ignorant, and dangerously unhinged.

The MRA Revenge

Just when I began to comprehend the misplaced rage of the MRM, Paul Elam and Diana Davison, his Canadian crony, kept it classy by publishing an article full of ad hominem attacks on me and my wife, entitled “Tim Tolka: Badass or Complete Ass”, where, among other things, they called my wife a hick and a coward for waiting 12 years to accuse her rapists and flatteringly compared me to Don Quijote, the deranged crusader and my favorite literary personage. They used the partial account of our activism available from media outlets which was already incomplete and written by journalists afraid to make the police look bad. So, together with their personal biases and their axe to grind, the post is complete bullshit, as they probably intended.

Apart from their demented criticism of our actions, which by publicizing the mishandling of the case by a local hillbilly Sheriff led to the intervention of the Attorney General’s Office, Elam and Davison advised that we “let the authorities handle it,” in other words the status quo, exemplified in my wife’s case, of official neglect and victim-blaming. This is sad, especially considering that these two entwined roots of injustice were probably also instrumental in silencing many victims among the users of AVfM.

Ironically, I felt complimented by the diligence of their spite, although both writers’ and their chorus of uncritical acolytes’ evident glee in lampooning a victim of gang rape shows their lack of empathy and their extreme misogyny… which is why the criticism AVfM received from SPLC is merited and why there needs to be “self-criticism” on the part of many MRA’s and Paul Elam in particular.

However, according to a blog post by Davison, there is no reason to even worry about whether rape is prosecuted, because false accusations comprise 40-60% of reported rapes. She even claims that false accusations lead to PTSD. Yeah. But ultimately, like most of the material written by MRA’s, much of the post relies on anecdote from another blog, although one pseudo-academic source is cited, a paper originally published in 2000 and collected by the National Coalition for Men.

Upon reading Davison’s sole source, I discovered that it presents no original research or statistical methodology in order to argue unconvincingly that the large consensus, already emergentthe-truth-about-the-truth-about1 by 2000, that as little as 2% of reported rapes are unfounded is not accurate. The writer, Edward Greer, points in all directions to locate holes in the statistics gathered by police and academic papers by feminist social scientists, but fails to even define what is and what is not a false claim, defined in detail here.

I’m not a fan of the FBI, but it is finally their statistics which everyone relies on to talk about crime in America, and they say unfounded reports constitute between 2-8% of cases. I don’t have a PhD in statistics, but that leaves a huge margin of error, because “unfounded” just means there wasn’t enough evidence, or that alcohol was involved. In fact, the FBI’s definition of rape didn’t even include the possibility of men as victims, and recently, as I wrote about here, the statistics of the FBI were found to have a massive discrepancy, because police have been quietly removing rape reports, which suggests that 2-8% is actually way above the actual statistical percentage. Greer couldn’t locate the holes which made the 2% figure a “myth” because he was looking in the wrong place. Instead of looking for false accusations, he should have looked for police misconduct and the “unfounding” of rape reports.

However, you can bet that Elam and Davison don’t know about and don’t care about such issues. They know what they believe, and it isn’t found in books! At least, not any books published by governments around the world, Pew, Gallup, the UN, World Bank, Amnesty International, the ACLU, Human Rights Watch, Harvard, Yale, or any other feminist-dominated institution!

It’s a shame, too, because many of the users of AVfM regard Elam as an almost Christ-like prophet and loyally accept his delusional vision of the world, despite the fact that he actually scores more points for feminism and disembowels his own movement by making threats and indulging in bizarre fantasies of violence against women:

scary paul

The quote above is taken out of a “satirical” article written by Elam in response to a Jezebel post which seemed to belittle the seriousness of violence by women against men. Elam manages to snag readers with these ploys, but I seriously doubt whether this satire goes down well with most people, which probably illustrates Elam’s point. It is worth noting that Jezebel’s article did not, however, use slurs or such violent language. Ultimately, many MRA’s are obviously furious at women and at the society which they believe caters too much to them, but they have very little to corroborate their gut feeling that women’s empowerment results in their demise.

For me, the saddest thing about the men’s rights movement is that by sadistically black-balling feminists and droning on about false rape accusations, they distract attention away from the legitimate points they make about how divorce courts, custody battles, unemployment, homelessness, and suicide adversely affect men, although none of those are the fault or goal of feminism. Feminism is just a convenient scapegoat to avoid looking at a more complicated picture where the causes of injustice are harder to isolate, which is a problem for many people trying to make sense of a system which seems stacked against them.

Perhaps, MRA’s can be forgiven for being confused about the causes of their unhappiness, but they definitely need to get better spokespersons, if they are ever going to be famous for anything other than their explosive misogyny and hatred.


  1. Actually the SPLC never declared the Men’s Rights movement to be a hate group

    > It should be mentioned that the SPLC did not label MRAs as members of a hate movement; nor did our article claim that the grievances they air on their websites – false rape accusations, ruinous divorce settlements and the like – are all without merit. But we did call out specific examples of misogyny and the threat, overt or implicit, of violence.

    The rest of your article is terribly researched, factually wrong, relies on grossly poor interpretations, full of cant and was a waste of your time.

    1. Yeah but AVfM is still labelled a hate group and the only reason /r/MensRights was removed was because they were too disorganised. Of course not every member of the MRM is a member of a hate group, but they never made that claim. They only released that statement because a large number of the movement can’t read/interpret words and began their cry of victimisation as they so often like to do.

    2. Does anyone who bothers to read actually take this seriously? I’m more than willing to bet he just found a Quote mined quote on the SPLC website and then stopped reading when the two didn’t agree on everything and then called the article “terribly research, factually wrong” and accused it of relying on “grossly poor intereptation” and being “full of can’t and a waste of your time” ….anon does not bother to even demonstrate a how or a why at all or Defend against the view that he probably just reviewed the SPLC and takes issue with the idea that they labeled the MRA a hate group even though it’s fairly obvious the SPLC called them out. It’s not enough to use Ad hominen arguments and declare the argument “terribly researched” You have to actually show why it was . Otherwise you just look intellectually lazy.

      Your reply is groundless and intellectually lazy.

  2. When I was a kid, my father got complete control over my upbringing because my mother was ill. He was an ardent feminist, and I am too, but I remember how he was discriminated against for being a dad with a little, little girl. From changing rooms to emergency calls, he was always questioned, even as I begged for him. I forever hate discrimination against male feminists, but today’s men’s rights pages frighten and bewilder me. I want my dad to be recognized for his care, but I want to hold on to his message of equality without the damnation of women’s rights.

    1. I agree- there should be middle ground between men’s rights and feminists where the two groups can meet and have productive interactions. Both parties probably need to tone down their rhetoric a bit. No more rape threats, no more misogyny, no more misandry, no more demonizing- but for now, both camps seem content with a caricature of each other.

    2. That is horrible that he was treated in such a way. I normally do not post replies on sites like this due to my personal beliefs. You see, I am one of those horrible, evil MRAs that you are all talking about. I won’t go into any rants or anything along those lines because that is not why I am hear right now. I just wanted to say that I think it is abhorrent the way your father was treated, and that ever father that who does his best for his child should be praised and celebrated.

  3. The bash a violent bitch month article is actually a satire article in response to Jezebel’s “Have you ever beat a boyfriend, cuz uh, we have” article in which the authors reminisce about being physically violent with their boyfriends. The article and comments from its readers seemed to take pride in their disgusting actions. This article is not satire and no it has not been taken down yet.

    1. Good point, I was not aware of that. It’s easy to take Elam’s comments out of context, because he says so much seemingly crazy shit. He sets himself up to be skewered by feminists, it’s like shooting fish in a barrel. However, that Jezebel article goes too far, if you are correct.

  4. You made a post on the AVFM forum here linking to this article and since my response is valid for both your post and this article I will post it below. I am not going to bother responding to the rest of the lies in your article because I doubt many people read it and even fewer believe it.

    Your post.!!!

    My response.
    Y know what dude, I don’t know enough about the back-story of what you have been through to comment on what Paul and other people did a year ago but I can kill your sacred rape cow very easily. The 2-8% figure quoted by feminists is complete bull. It has been falsely cited as being part of an FBI study but there have never been any FBI studies that give these figures. In fact based on DNA evidence from rape cases submitted to the FBI 20-26% of all allegations have been proven false. Bear in mind that these are only the ones that have been PROVEN false based on DNA evidence, the real figure is obviously much higher, in fact in all these cases there was only DNA evidence that sexual contact had taken place in 60% of all allegations. So basically the figure quoted by feminists is feminists lying about rape.

    In other cases where DNA evidence has been retroactively tested on people CONVICTED of rape 8-15% of these people have been proven innocent.

    Now if memory serves me correct the 2% figure came from feminist looking at the amount of women convicted for false allegations and claiming that every other accusation was true. They ignored the DNA evidence because it did not fit in with the lie they were promoting which was women never lie. However using the same logic you can say that since less than 10% of people are convicted of rape over 90% of allegations are false, which I find a lot more plausible than the dis-proven 2-8% figure. The initial figure they used to quote was 2% and it has become a very common figure used in feminist propaganda to claim women never lie, while ignoring evidence and lying about rape statistics.

    Then when 8-15% of people convicted were proven innocent they amended that figure to 8%.
    In other words the lowest number they could pick and they then lied about rape even more by then claiming it was 2-8% like that was the range, not that they had picked the lowest PROVEN example of false incarceration based on DNA evidence and stated that it was the highest rate of an official FBI estimation.

    How do we know women lie about rape, well the feminists have demonstrated that feminists lie about rape statistics.
    Just like you are now despite having several months to do your research.
    Oh yeah and that DNA evidence that proves that the bottom range of false allegations is 20-26%. Best estimate averages at 25% proven false based purely on DNA evidence so obviously the real figure is much higher, most surveys where women admit to lying about rape when confronted with lie detector tests end up with much higher results. (The range is about 30-70%) And these are women who admit lying. How many refuse to admit when confronted with a lie detector, not sure but possibly a fair bit more.

    In fact lying about rape and creating rape hysteria and using weaponised allegations against people who disagree with feminist dogma is pretty much the standard practice of emotional manipulation, blackmail and psychological abuse that feminists use to terrorise people into compliance. I can cite multiple examples of feminists manufacturing weaponised false allegations of rape against people but how about you do your own research and prove you understand the issue at hand and really are here to learn before showing up, playing the rape card and lying about rape statistics.

    QUOTE “(Every year since 1989, in about 25 percent of the
    sexual assault cases referred to the FBI where
    results could be obtained (primarily by State and
    local law enforcement), the primary suspect has
    been excluded by forensic DNA testing.)”

    percentages have remained constant for 7 years, and
    that the National Institute of Justice’s informal
    survey of private laboratories reveals a strikingly
    similar 26-percent exclusion rate)”


    There is a ton of other data here.
    So how about you read the well documented about section of this site with pages of surveys and cited examples before showing up, playing the rape card, lying about rape statistics before screaming that people on this site are saying stuff you don’t want to hear and it is horrific that you cant lie about rape statistics while playing the rape card. We know how to use Google and unlike you we get our sources from outside the feminist sphere of rape lies.


    End of cited post.

    1. I’m not sure what ‘playing the rape card’ means, but I’ll look into your sources. You sound like a conspiracy theorist, just saying. “Weaponised accusations” please.

      1. Sorry, how is using rape accusations as a weapon to hurt and terrorise people not weaponised accusations? Its a fact and I can provide examples.

        —- Quote —-

        Meg Lanker-Simons was a prominent Feminist blogger with nearly 60,000 followers. She had received an award by Think Progress for blogging the GOP primaries, and her Tumblr posts were widely shared over the internet. For being one woman in an oppressive patriarchy, she had quite a powerful voice.

        But apparently that wasn’t enough. In her last semester at UW she decided to give her activism an extra “punch” by writing out a rape threat against herself and submitting it to the Facebook page UW Crushes, which then reposted it on their page (this is a page that reposts anonymous “crushes” students submit to the page).

        The fake threat took the campus by storm, sparking a massive campus “anti-rape culture” rally which was covered on television by CBS and led by Lanker-Simons. She dramatized the event and heroized herself as much as she could, portraying herself on social media as a frail and innocent victim of an oppressive “rape culture” who was standing up for everyone else who was similarly victimized. At the same time she spread the rumor that the rape threat might have been posted by the UW Crushes page admins themselves to get more likes and shares for the page.

        After an investigation, the police discovered that the initial UW Crushes post had been submitted by an IP address registered to none other than Lanker-Simons. According to police documents, she confessed to the hoax but then retracted her confession. She was charged with interference with a police investigation.

        Instead of bringing this case to a merciful close, she decided to waste everyone’s time and taxpayer money by dragging out the legal process for six months, after which she accepted a plea deal in exchange for a “minimal fine” and no jail time.

        The University of Wyoming did absolutely nothing to punish her. She graduated and went on to attend law school. She remains a blogger with many followers, and there is no evidence that she has been called out or marginalized by her Feminist friends at all.

        —- End Quote —-

        Thats feminists weaponizing rape accusations.
        You can try and discredit me by calling me a “conspiracy theorist” but considering that I back up what I say with facts and I can show you plenty more examples. I have even seen a feminist make a false allegation against someone, all caught on video and then try and kill him while hundreds of feminists cheer and applaud. (This girl snuck up behind him, pushed her breasts against the back of his elbow, started screaming “get your hands off my breasts” before pushing him off a ledge where he smashed his skull open and was left in a massive pool of his own blood, then hundreds of feminist cheered)

        I suggest that you try backing up what you say because trying to discredit someone by calling them a “conspiracy theorist” despite the fact you admit you have done no research is simply a milder version of the tactics feminists use of calling anyone who disagrees with them a rapist.

      2. So AMRA on the basis of an Single Anecdotal experience of fabriciated evidence by Feminist generalized the experience to being “Standard practice” by feminist, meanwhile ignoring the danger women face when false rape reports are submitted and discredited this way.

        …. Yeah… I’m not seeing any reason to be skeptical of his reply…. at all. Nope. One False claim and now “all femniist” act this way

        can we get to the real point however which is that When a woman is convicted of False rape accusattions it has the effect of creating the Boy who cried wolf effect on women and even women have an incentive to dogpile on and Condemn women who make false reports.

  5. Also you cherry picked Paul’s article.
    (Pubisher’s note: This article, originally published on October 22, 2010, is a satirical response to a piece that appeared on the feminist site Jezebel (“Have you Ever Beat Up a Boyfriend? Because, Uh, We Have“) and to common media “jokes” about women physically assaulting men and boys. )

    ([Fogg Alert! Satire!] That’s it. In the name of equality and fairness, I am proclaiming October to be Bash a Violent Bitch Month.

    I’d like to make it the objective for the remainder of this month, and all the Octobers that follow, for men who are being attacked and physically abused by women – to beat the living shit out of them. I don’t mean subdue them, or deliver an open handed pop on the face to get them to settle down. I mean literally to grab them by the hair and smack their face against the wall till the smugness of beating on someone because you know they won’t fight back drains from their nose with a few million red corpuscles.

    And then make them clean up the mess.[/Fogg Alert])
    –End quotes–.

    I think you should have named your article
    If you piss off a mens rights activists, cherry pick quotes out of context and lie about rape statistics they will bitch slap you with the truth backed up with documented sources, prove you wrong and them mock you for being a lying uninformed idiot who is either lazy or unwilling to actually do real research because you are engrossed with trying to shame and silence them.

    1. Also I have trouble believing you don’t know what playing the rape card is unless you are just mimicking other feminists like a monkey.

      Ps, some more of the article.
      [not satire] You know, we used to have a name for people who only hit those that they knew wouldn’t fight back.


      And we all know that bullies are cowards. Put a hurting on one and they go find someone else to pick on every time. It’s what cowards do.

      [Stupid alert. For those too challenged to recognize satire, I spell it out for them]

      Now, am I serious about this?

      No.[/stupid alert] Not because it’s wrong. It’s not wrong. Every one should have the right to defend themselves. Hell, women are often excused from killing someone whom they allege has abused them. They can shoot them in their sleep and walk. Happens all the time. It’ll even get you a spot on Oprah, and cuntists across the cunt-o-sphere will be lionizing you.

      [not satire]In that light, every one of those women at Jezebel and millions of others across the western world are as deserving of a righteous ass kicking as any human being can be. But it isn’t worth the time behind bars or the abuse of anger management training that men must endure if they are uppity enough to defend themselves from female attackers.

      The better option is to kick her to the curb, figuratively speaking, and hopefully move on to some better choices. Besides, violence in self defense should be in some way commensurate with the violence of the attack.

      I will say this, though. To all the men out there that decided to say “Damn the consequences,” and fight back, you are heroes to the cause of equality; true feminists. And you are the honorary Kings of Bash a Violent Bitch Month. You are living proof of just how hollow “don’t fuck with us,” rings from the mouths of bullies and hypocrites.

      In the spirit of feminists everywhere, you GO, boy!
      –End Quote–

      1. What about Marissa Alexander, who fired a warning shot at her husband after he threatened to kill her? She faced 60 years in prison:

        She was sentenced to 20 years, but controversy ensued because it’s ridiculous. No one was hurt. Men are acquitted for killing their wives, but this woman? Denied ‘stand your ground’ defense:

        I’m aware that one case that illustrates a counterpoint does not win an argument, but I think your ‘feminists are bullies’ argument is invalid.

  6. Also I know I am giving you more attention than your bigoted hit piece deserves and that nobody comments on articles written by this crap website so your probably getting way more attention than you deserve but you played the rape card again at the start of the article by misquoting another of Paul’s works. Seems like you are a serial rape card player.

    But then that is to be expected because its standard feminist tactics.

    (Editorial note: among the thousands of articles published over the years of AVfM’s existence, a tiny handful are cited over and over again by dishonest critics of the Men’s Human Rights Movement as ‘typical” content for this publication. With about a thousand articles a year published on this site, it should be telling that only a small handful are cited over and over again as if they are typical, rather than unusual. This is one of those few articles.)

    (That would at least partly explain why there is currently far reaching efforts to broaden the definition of rape, given we interpret those efforts as an attempt to fulfill as many rape fantasies as possible.

    All this should be considered, however, with the caveat that the Romeo study found no results whatsoever as presented in paragraphs 1 and 2 of this article, and the fact that the Kale & Weiser and Fisk studies are not extant.

    These items, indeed this entire article, are illustrative examples of what Murray Straus identified as “Evidence by Citation” and other forms of academic fraud in widespread and unchallenged use by feminist ideologues. They were presented here as an example of their destructive use.)

    –End Quote–

    So there we have it, you lie about rape repeatedly, in one article alone.
    Emotional manipulation and lying about rape while playing the rape card.
    Did they teach you that in gender studies or did you just learn it from other feminists?

    Also I think its pure evil that your entire site seems to be about playing the rape card to get attention then insinuating that people who commit suicide and set themselves on fire are just MRA attention tactics. Seriously, take a good hard look at yourself, you are pure evil.

    1. Maybe people are missing the best content of AVfM because the satires I refer to are so over the top that they eclipse the more serious and compelling material on the site. What does that suggest to you? Maybe quite publishing stupid shit that offends people and they may take AVfM more seriously?

      I’m not going to address some of the other point you made, because they are absurd.

      However, the last part deserves a reply: maybe you can cite some sources to back up your accusation that I lie about rape? I can provide plenty of documentation that what I say is legit:

      I know you will discount this source because it has “violence against women” in the agency’s name- but the professor who wrote it is well-known nation-wide and is contracted by Universities and Police departments to train them.

      This one is government, does that mean it is feminist? It says the same thing. However, I am aware of other papers that put the number higher on false allegations, but there are a lot of mitigating factors in the analysis of such cases. It’s a hairy subject that is not at all as simple as MRA’s try to pretend.

      And I never said that Tom Ball’s self-immolation was an attention getting tactic, I said Elam’s satires are, but neither has generated as much press as you would expect, because the media doesn’t want to acknowledge your community. It’s worth thinking about why that is… instead of concluding that the world is run by feminists instead of taking a good look at what your movement is known for..

  7. God your so full of shit. You cherry pick a couple of satirical articles out of thousands published then claim not to have read them fully even though you write an entire article about them. and a couple of them have at the very top (THIS IS SATIRE)

    Perhaps your shit journalistic approach is really what got you fired from your last job. ANYONE WHO CLAIMS THE RATE OF FALSE ALLEGATIONS IS LESS THAN THE 26% that have been PROVEN false by DNA evidence is full of shit as are you.

    Also between 59-80% of convicted rapists have been abused by a woman, typically the mother.
    Which is no surprise considering women make up the vast majority of child abuse but are vastly less likely to get punished. Also rapists who have been abused by a woman pick women victims almost exclusively.

    (there is an alarmingly high rate of sexual abuse by females in the
    backgrounds of rapists, sex offenders and sexually aggressive men – 59%
    (Petrovich and Templer, 1984), 66% (Groth, 1979) and 80% (Briere and
    Smiljanich, 1993). A strong case for the need to identify female perpetrators can
    be found in Table 4, which presents the findings from a study of adolescent sex
    offenders by O’Brien (1989). Male adolescent sex offenders abused by “females
    only” chose female victims almost exclusively.)

    The table is on page 30 because I know your to fucking lazy to actually read the entire thing.

    As you can see, I actually do my research, you should try it sometime.

    Also I can find hundreds of examples of feminists defending female criminals, female child abusers and pretty much every example of evil that women perpetrate.
    Feminists are essentially child abuse apologists and sexist bigots.

    Your not going to address the points because you have no defence to your EVIL attitude of claiming men who kill themselves and set themselves on fire are just attention seekers.

    Your a feminist and your a nasty piece of shit. Saying that, most feminists are. Shall we go right back to the beginning. What about the white feather campaign where suffragettes shames men into going off an fighting in world war 1 & 2 by giving them a white feather to symbolize cowardice while complaining how hard women had it because they had to do the mans job for a few years while the men were out fighting and dying, Women targeting boys as young as 16, telling them to leave home and go fight and die for people who were complaining how hard women had it, these women had no regard for the lives of these men.

    Also the simple fact is that Germany starting wars got more women into the workplace than feminism ever has. Feminists at every turn have demanded that women get as much rights as possible with no accountability or responsibility. Women already get special treatment at every turn, by the legal system and society in general. All legal and lethal sexual discrimination in the western world is against men. There is no reason or excuse for being a feminist.

    What is even worse is that a large percentage of men who have been brainwashed by women from birth actually give women special treatment that they have never earned and defend every evil that women perpetrate. These people are the dumbest of the male sex and guess what, they just believe anything a woman says and they are the enforcers of feminist hypocrisy. I am looking at you when I say that. I know you are going to come out with a load of bullshit, lies, lame excuses, etc and when I have some decent free time I am probably going to blitz through your articles and this site and rip apart the feminist bigotry and lies with well documented facts.

    Ps, I am responding to a couple of points you made in response above because your not worthy of separate posts for them.I could rip apart every point you make but considering fuck all people read this shit website I don’t see why I should bother educating a lying sexist bigot.

    Feminism is an evil cancer that has infected western society and government desperate to appease female voters have trampled over the rights of men to gain women’s votes.

    Feminism is a movement full of nasty lying twisted people and you can find widespread systematic examples of this everywhere that feminists infect. Also any time that people stand up to feminist evil they respond with playing the rape card, victim card and make accusations against people that are not true, just like you have done.

  8. Fascinating post. Looking at this from the point of a recently retired Canadian secondary school teacher, I see another layer that is often missed in dealing with social issues such as these. Our school was a mixed composite school for a small town. We had all the levels in one school. Those levels do not just represent post secondary goal outcomes, they represent levels of society.

    Typically the largest portion in the average population is the middle group . On one end is the Academic stream heading to University & college. The other end are those who are life skills & workplace. The middle group are workplace, trades & college.

    One of the social economic realities of both Canada & America are the jobs that are disappearing were those aimed at the middle group. Furthermore, many of those jobs were predominantly male-centric. We now have a shift to work where one’s male gender does not give you an advantage. There are more better paying jobs available where things are equalized, but they require skills with higher education and fewer well paid hands-on labour occupations.

    As a result, there are a lot of frustrated males whose employment opportunities are shrinking through no fault of their own. They either find themselves coping with low paying work or now competing with both men & women for the higher end jobs. They perceive this inequality as coming from social change caused by feminist values, rather than an outcome of changes in technology and global market capitalism.

    We are not acknowledging this in our society at large, so the education system is not mandated to help the population adjust appropriately.

    1. Hey, thanks for your excellent comment. I very much agree. The same argument is made very eloquently by Michael Kimmel in “Angry White Men: American Masculinity in the End of an Era, excerpted here:

      It’s a shame that the actual causes are obscured by face-saving politicians, because it is clear that the global economy has left these guys dislocated and dispossessed. However, there is also a bit more to it, I suspect, when it comes to men’s rights activists. Not all, but many of these men simply hate women.

      They’re angry at their mother’s, their ex-wives, and every woman who ever turned them down and made them feel inadequate. The men’s rights movement is their rationalization. It’s a rallying cry, but it’s also just hatred, pure and simple. I think the economic and political arguments are just icing on the cake, to make it seem more structured and intelligent than blind hatred.

  9. tolkatim your an idiot who basically attempts to minimalise the very real discrimination in society against men using ad homium slurs and slanders, when mens rights activists are campaigning for ending discrimination against men in family law, the legal system, divorce courts you scream mysogany and oh my god these people hate women and they are angry at their mothers, etc. What you have done is just a form of emotional manipulation and shaming when men complain about very serious issues, your a disgusting human being and an emotionally manipulative troll.
    I think its probably fair to you to say that your mother had zero regard for your emotional well being when she brainwashed you to be such a disgusting feminist misandrist. Cut the umbilical cord and educate yourself. All Legal and Lethal discrimination in the western world is against men. check out

    Also find me one article on AVFM where the author goes I hate my mother, then run a search for articles about discrimination in heathcare, education, divorce courts, family law and its pretty obvious that your attempts at an ad homium derailment is completely false.

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